Show Notes
In this episode of Peaceable and Kind, Derek Vreeland explores the virtue of humility and why it is essential for recovering from hypocrisy. Humility has never been particularly popular. We want to be powerful, smart, and great, yet Jesus points us toward a different kind of greatness. While Aristotle celebrated the virtue of magnanimity, or “greatness of soul,” Jesus taught his disciples that true greatness is found in becoming humble.
Drawing from Jesus, Paul, John Chrysostom, Anthony the Great, Thomas Merton, and Dallas Willard, Derek explores humility as a “lowly mind”—an honest acceptance of who we are before God. Humility is not self-loathing, passivity, or groveling. It is living honestly within the reality of who God has made us to be, recognizing both our dignity and our limitations, and allowing God’s grace to fill in the gaps.
Derek also explores Thomas Merton’s distinction between being and doing. Our actions reveal something about us, but our identity cannot be reduced to what we accomplish. When we become obsessed with our outward performance, we can lose touch with the deeper work God is doing within us.
Humility, according to Willard, has three steps:
- Never pretend
- Never presume
- Never push
In following these steps, we create room for the Spirit to form us into people who are increasingly free from hypocrisy and increasingly like Jesus.
Key Takeaways
Humility is not self-loathing or passivity.
Christian humility begins with an honest view of ourselves before God.
Jesus presents humility as the pathway to true greatness.
Hypocrisy attempts to manage and inflate our image; humility frees us from the need to pretend.
Humility helps expose spiritual pride and self-reliance.
Our identity is deeper than what we accomplish.
Being precedes doing: our actions flow from who we are.
God’s grace meets us in both our strengths and our limitations.
Humility creates space for genuine spiritual transformation.
Books Mentioned
Nicomachean Ethics — Aristotle
New Seeds of Contemplation — Thomas Merton
The Sayings of the Desert Fathers: The Alphabetical Collection — translated by Benedicta Ward
Streams in the Wasteland — Andrew Arndt
Scriptures Mentioned
John 10:10
Matthew 18:3–4
Philippians 2:3
Matthew 23:11–12
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Transcript
Welcome back to another episode of peaceable and kind.
I am your host, Derek Vreeland.
Hope you’re having a good day today
as the summer months wind down
and fall is on its way,
which means high school, college,
and professional football is back.
Very excited about that.
And excited that you’ve joined me for this episode
as we together explore the topic of humility.
But before we jump into today’s topic,
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Humility is not necessarily everyone’s favorite topic.
People wanna know how to get ahead.
They want to know how to have success in life.
I mean, let’s be honest,
humility is no more popular today
than it was in Jesus’ day.
Humility doesn’t sound appealing
because we want to be powerful.
However, we define that.
We wanna be intellectually astute.
We wanna be smart.
We wanna be great.
And topics like humility,
well, it just seems so cramped and dull.
Well, in the first century Roman Greco world,
it was the same.
People were looking for ways to grow intellectually.
They were looking for ways to get ahead,
to be powerful, to be successful.
And the first century Roman Greco world drink deeply
from the well of Greek philosophy.
One of the things that we see in the New Testament,
in particular, first Corinthians,
we see that what was prized,
what was valuable in the Hellenistic world
among the Greeks was intellectual pursuits.
Greeks wanted to know and grow in wisdom.
And the philosophical tradition
that comes from Athens
is one that has shaped all of Western civilization,
including Christianity,
the religion which grew up around Jesus.
So it was important for Greek minded people of Jesus’ day
to focus on these intellectual pursuits,
which is why humility never appeared
on any of their lists of virtues.
Hopefully you have heard by now
that I’m working on a new book
that’s coming out fall 2027,
Recovering Hypocrites Discarding Image Management
for Whole-Hearted Integrity.
And in this book, I am dealing with matters of being
and doing.
The problem with hypocrisy is that
who a person is on the inside doesn’t match
what’s on the outside.
And we all recognize that problem.
And I think the resources to overcome that problem,
to course correct, to fully recover from our hypocrisy
is found in the virtue tradition.
So this new book that I’m working on,
and if you’ve followed the podcast for a while,
you have noticed episodes in the last 12 months
about character, about virtue.
I interviewed Lou Marcos about his book
from Aristotle to Christ.
I’ve been working for years reading and researching
and thinking about how the virtue tradition
which has been given to us from Aristotle
and brought into the church
through the work of Saint Thomas Aquinas,
how this, the virtue tradition is what we need
to recover from our hypocrisy.
And so the ancient Greeks,
they had their list of virtues,
all sorts of different philosophies
and philosophers had different lists
and humility did not appear on any of them.
Humility in the sense of a lowly mind
was not valued in the first century world.
I mean, if we go back to Aristotle
in his foundational book, the Nicomachean Ethics,
Aristotle doesn’t talk about humility
but he does include greatness of soul as a virtue.
Now I like to call this virtue greatness of soul.
Traditionally it’s called magnanimity,
which is kind of a big word that it seems very, very archaic.
And so I like newer English translations
of Aristotle’s works that use the word greatness of soul
instead of magnanimity.
But you may have heard that
depending on how wide you’re reading
that people can be magnanimous.
And so the meaning though of the Greek word
really is greatness of soul.
So for Aristotle, there was a virtue, right?
A very good habit of a person who was great of soul.
This is a person who according to Aristotle
deems himself worthy of great things
and is worthy of them.
Now remember that for Aristotle,
he sees reality in terms of what things are,
actuality and what things can be, potentiality.
So when he sees a great man
who does great and noble things
and knows that he has greatness within his character,
it is a virtue that he possesses
and this is a good thing.
For Aristotle, that person,
the person who does noble things,
has noble character and knows it,
this is the virtue of greatness of soul.
Now this person, the magnanimous person
isn’t chasing after recognition and clout,
but they simply welcome and accept honor
when it comes to them.
They don’t go into a mode of sort of false humility.
Oh no, no, no, I didn’t do anything great.
I just did this, that, and the other.
No, when they do something great and noble
and virtuous and kind
and they are shown respect and honor for that,
they receive it.
They don’t chase after it, but they receive it.
So for Aristotle, greatness of soul as a virtue,
it’s not being arrogant, it’s just being honest.
And Aristotle goes on to describe it
as an ornamental virtue,
that is it arises in a person’s character
because of other virtues,
virtues like nobility and generosity and goodness.
I mean, greatness of soul is not one
of the high moral virtues on Aristotle’s list,
but it does appear.
Christians, on the other hand,
don’t place much emphasis on magnanimity,
that is greatness of soul.
Rather, what we see in Jesus and in the apostles
and throughout church history
is something much more valuable than greatness of soul,
and that is the virtue of humility.
Now, the path to the good life
according to Jesus begins
when we become the kind of people
who are suspicious of our greatness.
One of the things that Aristotle and Jesus have in common
is this focus on the good life.
Aristotle says that all of our ethical
and moral thinking is wrapped up
in the target we are shooting for.
That is that every action,
every thought and motivation
is aimed towards some kind of good.
Jesus talked about the good life.
So in John 10, 10, Jesus says,
he has not come to steal and kill and to destroy.
That’s what the thief comes to do.
Rather, Jesus comes that we might have life
and have it abundantly.
I love the new living translation that’s John 10.
The new living translation records Jesus is saying,
I have come that they might have a rich and satisfying life.
So both Jesus and Aristotle
get us focused towards the end game.
What is the end game?
Well, for Aristotle, it is human flourishing,
also the understanding of happiness
in a true moral sense, not just an emotional sense.
And for Jesus, the good life is a life lived of love,
loving God and loving neighbor as you love yourself.
So Jesus holds out in front of us
the vision of a good life.
And the virtues that is the quality of our character
that gets us to that good life
is not this greatness of soul,
but being suspicious of our own greatness.
When Jesus was asked by his disciples
who was the greatest in the kingdom of heaven,
Jesus responded by inviting a child into their midst.
And then this is what happens next.
This is in Matthew 18.
Then Jesus said, I tell you the truth,
unless you turn from your sins
and become like little children,
you will never get into the kingdom of heaven.
So anyone who becomes as humble
as this little child is the greatest in the kingdom of God.
Jesus spoke often of humility.
Throughout the New Testament, you hear, you read,
you see this reoccurring theme
that God gives grace to the humble,
but God is opposed to the proud.
So humility has always been
a deep Christian virtue,
but not necessarily a Greek virtue.
So Jesus here uses a child as an object lesson.
He says, if you want to enter into the kingdom of heaven,
you gotta repent, you gotta change.
You gotta turn from your sins and be like a child.
And what he draws out from the image of a child
is their humility.
Children in the ancient world,
both in the Jewish world and the Roman Greco world,
were not necessarily lifted up
as examples of moral greatness.
They were silly and intellectually immature.
They were dependent on their parents and teachers
because they obviously lacked the kind of life experience
to have the discernment and wisdom of adults.
Children like social and legal status
in the ancient Roman world,
they had not lived enough life
to be the moral exemplars in the world.
And yet Jesus chooses the simplicity
and humility of a child
to show us the way to goodness, greatness, the good life.
And humility in a Christian sense is not passivity.
It’s not self loathing.
It’s not cowering or groveling
from a place of indignity.
I mean, Jesus came to save us
and to restore us to what God designed us to be.
From Jesus, we learned that we have worth and dignity.
I am loved, you are loved
because as we find ourselves in Jesus,
the words that God the Father spoke to Jesus
at his baptism, God also speaks to us.
And if you remember what God said
at the baptism of Jesus,
this is my beloved son and him I am well pleased.
And so because we find ourselves united with Jesus,
God the Father says the same things about us.
Today, God the Father is saying,
you are my beloved daughter.
You are my beloved son and you I am well pleased.
Jesus came to restore us, to save us,
to transform us in the love of God.
And so humility in the Christian tradition
is not the wilting of the soul,
a hating on oneself because of a misaligned identity.
Rather, humility is simply having a lowly mind,
which is why Paul writes in Philippians 2 verse 3,
don’t be selfish, don’t try to impress others,
be humble, thinking of others as better than yourselves.
Now, I believe that humility as a Christian virtue
is absolutely indispensable
if we’re gonna fully recover from our hypocrisy.
Hey friends, I wanna pause this episode
for just a moment to let you know
that Resurrection, eight lessons on how God restores us.
The third and final book
in the God in the Neighborhood Bible Study series
is out now.
Go to the show notes for ordering information.
Now, I define hypocrisy
as an intentional, rational strategy
of trying to reap all the benefits
of belonging to a certain religious group
without paying any of the costs.
And Jesus in particular had a lot of difficult things
to say to religious hypocrites.
Now, you know, as much as I know,
that there’s no one who likes hypocrites in general
and specifically religious hypocrites.
And I’ve admitted there are times
that I fall into the role of the hypocrite.
I’m a recovering hypocrite too.
I don’t excuse myself from this,
but I hear Jesus in his critique of hypocrisy
and I want to live my life authentically.
So if I’m gonna recover from my hypocrisy,
if we’re gonna recover from our hypocrisy,
then we need to grow in the virtue of humility.
Now, when we practice hypocrisy,
we spend so much of our time, energy,
and effort in managing our image
because on the exterior,
we want to look like we’re true believers, right?
That we’re holy, that we’re doing the right things.
We want people to see that on the outside
even if we’re lacking the inner transformation on the inside,
we simply are pretending.
Now, Jesus, before he launches into his seven woes
against the Pharisees in Matthew 23, has this to say,
this is Matthew 23, verses 11 and 12.
Jesus says, the greatest among you must be a servant,
but those who exalt themselves will be humbled
and those who humble themselves will be exalted.
In other words, Jesus is saying,
if you want an exalted image,
if you want to look like a true believer,
if you want to look holy,
if you want to look like you’re doing all the right things,
the way to do that is that to puff yourself up,
but it’s to humble yourself.
And so humility as a foundational block
of our character gives no room for hypocrisy to survive.
When hypocrites take the stage,
they want to pop up their image,
but it’s humility that pumps the bricks.
Humility is like, hypocrisy is like, look how good I am,
look how spiritual I am.
And humility is like, hold on a second.
All the good that is in my life is because of Jesus.
Humility springs the snare of spiritual pride
and stubborn self-reliance.
Now I need to pause here for just a moment
of true confession.
I struggle with spiritual pride
and with stubborn self-reliance.
I’m talking about myself here.
Self-sufficiency is my besetting sin.
I do at times overestimate my abilities in the Christian life.
And I think if I just lean hard enough
on my talents, abilities and gifts
that I really can grow in this Christian faith.
This entire podcast episode is me talking to me about me.
And so what I’ve learned in my spiritual journey
is it is true that humility springs the snare
of spiritual pride, stubborn self-reliance.
When we are prideful,
when we are addicted to our own way of thinking,
that is a snare, that is a trap that is set by the enemy.
Anthony the Great, who was the first of the Desert Fathers,
famously said, I saw the snares
that the enemy spread out over the world.
And I said, groaning, what can get through
from such snares?
Then I heard a voice saying to me, humility.
The ancient Christians, particularly the Desert Fathers,
do you know about the Desert Fathers?
There’s a number of wonderful books that I would recommend.
The first would be Streams in the Wasteland by Andrew Art.
I think that’s a great introduction to the Desert Fathers.
But the Desert Fathers and Mothers grew up at a time
in the fourth, fifth century and moving forward
when the church was accommodating itself to Roman culture.
This is after Christianity is no longer a persecuted religion
that eventually becomes the state religion
of the Roman Empire.
And there were Christians who felt
that the church was compromising.
And so men and women who loved Jesus
would move and live out in the desert
and would practice silent solitude, fasting, contemplation.
And all of their writings or their sayings were collected
in a book entitled The Sayings of the Desert Fathers.
I recommend that.
But check out Andrew Art’s Streams in the Wasteland.
But Anthony the Great, Abba Anthony,
was really the forerunner.
He was the first at these Desert Fathers
and he was known for his great spirituality
and for his wisdom.
And he saw humility as that component of our character
that rescues us from all of the traps set by the enemy.
And it just seems like Christians that are strong
in the area of Christian mysticism,
those that are sort of these spiritual saffats,
these contemplative kind of Christians,
they all seem to see and know the value
of the virtue of humility.
In more modern times in the 20th century,
there’s no Christian contemplative
that stands out more in my opinion than Thomas Merton.
And he talks about humility
in the new seeds of contemplation,
which I think is a great place to start
if you want to read Merton.
Now, his new seeds of contemplation
doesn’t read as a linear book
from page one to page 150, wherever it ends.
It’s really just a collection of thoughts and ideas,
birth from a deep place of prayer and union with God.
And I just think Merton is brilliant.
I turn to him time and time again.
And so Merton says this about humility.
He writes, Christian humility is first of all,
a matter of supernatural common sense.
It teaches us to take ourselves as we are
instead of pretending as pride would have us imagine
that we are something better than we are.
Merton just sums it up so well here.
Humility is not hating on ourselves.
Humility is not choosing not to grow intellectually
and to learn.
Humility is first and foremost about common sense.
It’s about honesty.
It’s about seeing ourselves as we are.
So a person with the greatness of soul virtue
that Aristotle talks about
might look within their heart and through their actions
and just see all of their achievements
and maybe their great achievements.
But in the Christian tradition,
we’re taught instead to look within
and to see where we have not been perfected in love.
It’s just an honest take with who we are.
This is why humility is such an important anecdote
for hypocrisy.
Because with hypocrisy, we’re just focused
on what people see on the outside.
We avoid what’s happening on the inside.
But Merton, like so many before him,
understood this wisdom of simply being honest
with ourselves.
We have dark regions still within our hearts.
We have thoughts that have not been fully renewed
by the Holy Spirit.
None of us have yet arrived
though we are pressing towards maturity in Jesus,
we haven’t arrived yet.
We’re not fully perfected in love.
And so the virtue of humility
allows us to have a true and honest assessment
of who we are, where we are
and how what we do shapes what we do.
And I think if we lean into this virtue,
we can begin to untangle the knots
created by our hypocrisy.
So if humility is, as Merton says it is,
and I believe it is,
that it’s simply taking ourselves as we are,
I think this is why Dallas Willard
says the first step to humility is to never pretend.
So Dallas Willard, who has been
a very influential Christian thinker
and writer in my life,
he delivered a chapel address at Wheaton College
in April of 2009.
And in that address,
he gives three simple steps to humility.
So if you’re a linear thinker
and you like steps like action items,
then here we go.
If you want to grow in the knowledge of humility,
if you want to grow in the practice
and the awareness of humility,
here are three things you can do.
I won’t say that again.
I was looking at my notes for the next thing
after the three steps.
I didn’t see it, but now I do.
Okay, I’m gonna go back to,
this is why Willard says the first step
to humility is never pretend.
Okay, then I’m gonna take off from that.
And Dallas Willard has been
a very influential Christian thinker
and writer in my own life.
And in April of 2009,
he was participating in the Life in the Spirit,
Spiritual Formation Conference of Wheaton College.
And on April 17th,
he delivered a chapel address during their chapel service.
And in that message and that presentation in the chapel,
he gave three steps to humility.
So if you’re like me and you like action items,
things that you can do and you like a numbered list,
I’m gonna tell you what,
nothing pleases me more
than a well-organized numbered list.
So if you like that,
I wanna wrap up the podcast episode
with Willard’s three steps to humility.
Number one, and they’re all peas, by the way.
So if you like the alliteration, there you go.
Step number one, three steps to humility
from Dallas Willard.
Step one, never pretend.
Number two, never presume.
Number three, never push.
These are the things that we can do or not do
in order to grow in the virtue of humility.
So I love the way Willard presents it,
but they’re all negations.
They’re all three things not to do.
So I would see them more action-oriented
when we begin to see the shape of Christian humility
in this way.
Number one, humility is being real with who you are.
Number one, right?
This is the never pretend.
Humility is about being real with who you are.
Saying, this is the content of my character right now.
These are my character strengths.
These are my character deficiencies.
These are the virtues that I excel at.
These are the virtues that I struggle with.
That’s what humility is.
Spiritual pride would say,
oh, I am so much better than other people.
I am smarter.
I do better.
In all of these different areas.
And that’s why that becomes a spiritual snare,
a spiritual trap.
Humility, according to Willard,
not pretending it’s just being real with who you are.
Number two, humility is living life
based on that reality.
Willard says, never presume, right?
Never think that you’re at the top or at the bottom.
Just don’t make assumptions.
Instead, humility teaches us to live life
based on the reality of who we are.
I grew up as a child,
hearing that I can do anything I set my mind to.
And friends, let me tell you what, that is not true.
I, when I was younger, before Jesus
was that the center of my life,
I set my mind to being a great basketball player.
And guess what?
I lack hand-eye coordination.
I was always fast.
I could always run in a straight line.
I always worked real hard on the basketball court,
but I was never a great basketball player.
You can’t do anything you set your mind to do.
And humility is simply that awareness,
being aware of who you are,
strengths and weaknesses,
and then living life based on that.
And then thirdly, humility is being comfortable
with who you are and letting God’s grace fill in the gaps.
You don’t have to push to make yourself look greater.
You don’t have to push to be some great person.
Instead, humility teaches us simply to rest in who we are
and to trust that God’s grace
will be sufficient in our weaknesses.
Well, I hope this was encouraging to you, friend.
I hope that it encourages you to pursue and grow
in the area of humility so that you can be like Jesus.
Well, that is all that we have for this episode.
Thank you for joining me.
Go in peace and be kind.
This transcript was generated with AI and may contain errors.